Liveblogging the DOTC (Debate of the Century) October 2, 2008
Posted by downwithabsolutes in DE Politics.trackback
I’m here at Timothy’s on the Riverfront and the place is packed. Don’t notice too many people I know (where my bloggers at?!?). I’ve ordered an iced tea with extra lemon and the nachos!!!
903 pm: She’s got to be shitting her pants.
904 pm: I wonder if Palin is doodling on her pad or writing rebuttal points.
905 pm: The first “betcha” of the night.
906 pm: Grade for first Palin response pre-suspension-of-campaign-mention: A-. Post-mention: B-
908 pm: Love how Palin’s trying to explain McCain’s words for him re: “fundamentals of economy are strong” comment.
909 pm: Biden needs to stop smiling. Right now. And Palin needs to stop talking in soundbites. Right now.
911 pm: Americans are “hurtin’” says Palin!
914 pm: Biden really needs to stop smiling. People will see it as condescension.
917 pm: Catty bitch loves her some soundbites: “Redistribution of wealth”
922 pm: Bridge to Nowhere. Zing!!
932 pm: I’ve got to give it to Palin. She’s doing very well. This was so Biden’s game. All Palin had to do was not fuck up catastrophically. But she’s holding her own, even thought she’s behaving a bit too cutesy. He’s flubbed a bit (as has she), but I don’t see him being overly flustered by sharing the stage with an amateur.
935 pm: She says: Nuk-u-lar. Oh my. More George Bush.
937 pm: Palin is parsing on the same-sex benefits issue. Surprise. I guess she’s got to give the base their red meat.
940 pm: Where’s the damn up-do?
941 pm: Is it me, or does Palin seem like she’s simply reciting from a script or reading a teleprompter? She seems so fake.
943 pm: White flag of surrender? Chick, please shut the fuck up.
945 pm: As my mother would say…God love him…LOL. Good stuff.
950 pm: Zing!!! McCain wouldn’t sit down with Spain! Eat that shit, Sarah!
951 pm: Kilroy is sitting next to me. He says: “She’s starting to break.”
952 pm: “In fairness to Sec. Ric, she’s trying to turn it around in the 7th and 8th year.” Good one!
954 pm: “We both love Israel.” My god what a fucking shallow witch.
957 pm: Joan Rivers showed up: “Can we talk about Afghanistan for a second?”
958 pm: Biden says that a general said the surge won’t work in Afghanistan.
1003 pm: Where is the substance coming from Palin so non-existent. The “You voted for the war before you voted against it line” is soooo 2004.
1005 pm: Palin: “That legislation hasn’t passed yet.” LMFAO!!!
1009 pm: Palin: “A team of maverick.” Jesus, woman, get the FUCK over it.
1012 pm: Palin: Biden’s wife’s gift “is in heaven” ?!? Wow. A shout-out to her brother?!?!? Jesus, what is this? Power 101 radio station?
1016 pm: Palin can’t answer the question re: is the VP’s office covered under the Executive Branch.
1017 pm: Biden shatters Palin’s stupidity on the above question. Cheer in the crowd.
1018 pm: Didn’t Ifill ask what each candidate’s Achilles’ Heel was?!? Why is Palin not answering?
1023 pm: Did Palin just say about McCain: “He’s the man that we need to LEAVE?” instead of “lead?”
1028 pm: Palin: “You don’t just walk the walk, you talk the talk.” Jesus this is an election of sloganeering!
1031 pm: Final grades. Biden: B+. Palin: C+. Want to know my final thoughts? Tune in tomorrow between 3-5 pm on DelawareTalkRadio.com!.
1034 pm: The crowd at Timothy’s: “Barack and Joe we’re ready to go!!”
Comments
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downwithabsolutes
Dominique
Mike Matthews
It’s 9:21 and so far she is flat out kicking Joe’s ass. I didn’t expect this at all.
No she’s not kicking his ass. She’s at least doing as well as him, but she’s relying too much on soundbites. I know you hate Biden and Obama, Dom, but look at this for real. I am giving her lots of credit because she is doing VERY well (mostly because I had sucj low expectations). But, again, she’s relying on the cutesy colloquialisms and folksy soundbites. It’s very unbecoming and, quite frankly, fucking annoying.
OK, 929 pm…why is she fucking DEFLECTING. Biden levels a charge, but Palin says she doesn’t agree, and then insists on moving to a different topic. Dom?!?
oops…foreign policy….
I love reading Michelle Malkin’s non-sensical attacks on Biden.
Wow she told us to trust the leader of al Qaeda and to mistrust the Castro brothers. Haha. She’s awful.
I can’t bring myself to condemn her performance. Presentation-wise and keeping up, she’s doing VERY well. As far as substance, it’s all so superficial.
“As far as substance, it’s all so superficial.’
Should that be the crime, both would be guilty.
No, miscreant, and you’re full of shit. I’ve been conciliatory to Republicans in the past and am very willing to concede when a point is made. But Palin came to the table with NOTHING outside of constant sloganeering and soundbites. Stop defending this woman. I’ve admitted she did a HELUVA lot better than I could have ever expected. BUt that was based on her performance and on the fact that she didn’t “umm” and “ahh” her way into crash and burn.
There WAS no substance there. None.
The well scripted, well rehearsed Prom Queen couldnt resist using the word “also” in every sentence.
Expansion of the VP office? Obviously hasn’t read the Consitution.
Never answered a question, but used her talking points and staying on that false “maverick” image.
Wants to place an embassy in Jerusalem which will drive Muslims crazy….so much for her understanding of the most horrific real estate on the planet. Jerusalem!
Her grasp of the language using “you guys” and other unedcated, not ready for prime time speak. She is a joke and proved it tonight.
And we know now that John McSame is going to give you $5000 tax CREDIT so you can pay for your healthcare, but that money goes straight to the insurance companies….thanks for looking out for those corporations John!
His health care plan will let you purchase across state lines. Great! Doctors will just love having to hire a few more pencil pushers in their offices to deal with all that paperwork. Of course, their whole plan falls short because if you buy your insurance, ie. Calfornia, you have to find a Doctor in Delaware who is signed on with that insurance provider! Too dumb to be Governor.
i just love how AWFUL Ifill came to joe’s ‘rescue’ … SARAH PALIN (oh how i love her) directed most if not all of her comments to the American people … HOWEVER the PIT BULL turned to look DIRECTLY at Biden and leveled a serious charge … i was so taken with her understanding of tactics and ‘pack mentality’ that i immediately understood what was going on … the split screen camera also showed that the attack worked … Biden was coming unglued and that’s when AWFUL Ifill talked him off the ledge with “senator you’ve had a WONDERFUL record of blah blah blah darfur blah blah” … stroked his little ego and brought him right back in line … did AWFUL Ifill ever say “governor you’ve had a WONDERFUL record of … ” ANYTHING???? also did you notice how he mentioned NObama as an afterthought, it was mostly all about Biden … Sarah had the presence of mind to understand her role is John McCain’s right hand man …
‘But Palin came to the table with NOTHING outside of constant sloganeering and soundbites.’
I suppose you didn’t notice that virtually every response Barack Obama gave during last week’s debate was a line from a stump speech.
Sorry, I had to bail last night. I can’t watch tv and read the blog at the same time and The Sarah Show was simply too good to miss.
She was a bit folksy, but she rocked the house. She wasn’t going to change Obama supporters’ minds, but don’t doubt for a second that she connected with millions of non-partisans sitting on the fence who don’t feel passionately one way or another. She demonstrated a warmth and personality that Barack Obama can only dream of and that matters to voters (see: 2000 & 2004).
No flubs, no mistakes, no slogans.
Good defense for Gov Palin and no offensive remarks by Sen Biden.
Dull night.
thanks for that comment Mike, now go pick up your signs that are still laying all over the place.
Mike: Biden smashed Palin on the VP question? He said Article I covers the veep’s duties/powers!! Um, that would be Article II, Joe. Some lawyer!
Hube, get over it. I will be pointing that out on air today, but I won’t be ignoring Biden’s major point. Why are you?
Plus, he was dead wrong in explaining the position of VP. He said it was executive branch in the constitution, he also said the VP only has a role during Senate ties. WRONG WRONG WRONG.
Talk about a major flub!!!! Biden doesn’t even know what the hell position he is running for or what the constitution calls for in terms of VP.
What a complete jackass.
Mike: Great retort. YOU get over it. (Or should I say “get over yourself?) Cripes, I put up a whole post about my embarrassment over Palin not being able to cite a SCOTUS case, yet somehow to you and other “progressives,” a 35 year vet of government who doesn’t know that Hoover, not FDR, was prez when the stock market crashed in ‘29, and that there was no TV then either, and that doesn’t what article of the Constitution discusses the veep’s duities … ain’t a big deal.
Why is that, Mike? Is your “balance” all just a big phony ruse, hmmm??
Hube: I said I would be talking about this by calling Biden the MORON he is for not knowing the appropriate Article. You, on the other hand, have been nothing but a constant apologist for Palin until it became ABSOLUTELY, EXPLICITLY CRYSTAL CLEAR that we’re working with a woman who has no clue what the FUCK she’s doing. Yes, Hube, I believe I’m more balanced. I am supporting a candidate and you are supporting a candidate. However, I have certainly been more balanced in ripping apart “my guy” early on (and Democrats in general whether locally or nationally), while you seem to be content in your den of anti-Messiah-ness. Which is fine, but you make a niggling, if valid point against Biden for another stupid gaffe while ALTOGETHER ignoring the major thesis of his argument.
Again, where ARE YOU ON THE ISSUE OF VP power in this country? Al Mascitti made a great point this morning — if that question were asked in 2000, you KNOW where the Republicans would have been! They’d be saying the same thing the Dems are saying now.
That’s right, Mike — I have indeed been FAIR to Palin as you and the “progressive” blogosphere have been putting out more unsubstantiated tripe about Palin in a month than Obama dealt with in over a year. Golly — I want to see PROOF of Palin not being able to answer a question? For SHAME!! Should I list all the crap that has been debunked about her, yet is still promulgated by the MSM?
Spare me. Maybe you missed my comment at DE Liberal (I thought you frequent ther!) where I said I won’t even vote for prez. now. So much for your “my candidate” canard.
Balanced my ass.
Hube,
I retract when I’m wrong. I’ve done it before and I’m sure I’ll do it again. You claimed the tape didn’t exist of Palin being unable to name another Supreme Court case. I conceded there was a chance it didn’t exist.
Yes, Hube, I do believe that I’m more balanced because I put myself OUT THERE and see what really goes on in our political system — particularly here in Delaware. The Democrats are just as vicious and ridiculous as the Republicans — especially in this state. However, the Republicans have been leading for six of the last eight years in Washington and it’s time for them to go. I have also conceded on several blogs — yours, to be exact, if I remember correctly — that if Obama is a COMPLETE fuck-up I will likely vote for the Republican in 2012. As long as that Republican isn’t Sam Brownback, Rick Santorum (or some other WAAAYYY bigoted GOPer) or some iteration therein, anyway.
It’s the same reason, Hube, that I said I would be voting for Bill Lee should John Carney receive the Dem. nomination. After eight years of Aunt Ruth Ann, we couldn’t have another four years of one of her cronies, who likely would have kept the same staff, the same cabinet and the same politics as usual in Delaware. Markell may still be a Democrat, but he’s pledging to clean house and I believe him.
You see, it really boils down to competence as well as politics. Ruth Ann Minner and George Bush have proven to be incompetent leaders. In both cases, the public generally agrees. The only way we can send a message is by, yes, latching on to an argument for “CHANGE.” (I know, it’s killin’ ya, Hube!). Obama may be a scary man with a scary preacher and a wife who simply doesn’t know her place. Obama may be one step from being a full blown socialist bent on ridding this country of all religion and imposing 90% tax rates on the wealthy. Obama may, indeed, be the Second Coming – the messiah, so to speak. And he may be a complete trainwreck. But, Hube, ask yourself this: Can he be any worse than 8 years of George Bush?
I need some damn coffee.
BUt that was based on her performance and on the fact that she didn’t “umm” and “ahh” her way into crash and burn.
There WAS no substance there. None.
*
Not much, anyway. Pathetic that all Dom has got is that she wants a Palin/Obama debate.
The two VEEP candidates were a pretty pair. Biden kept looking like Cary Grant to me. They have the same mouth and jaw and blinding smile.
Palin’s looks are undeniable but she unfortunately smiles at inappropritate moments. And like GWB, doesn’t she know the difference between nuclear and nucular?
“Ruth Ann Minner and George Bush have proven to be incompetent leaders”
If you’re voting for Obama to prevent 4 more years of Bush, will you be voting for Bill Lee to prevent 4 more years of Minner?
Dizzy,
Markell is not another four years of Minner. If Markell fails, then I’ll be supporting his opponent in 2012 (should he win).
Mike and Hube,
Please read the constitution, inteadof Regurgitating some other commentator.
Article 1 states: “The Vice President of the United States shall be President of the Senate, but shall have no vote, unless they be equally divided. ”
Biden was CORRECT.
Article 2, Deals mostly with the President and the overall executive. BUT Article 1, specifically states the DUTY of the VP.
‘inteadof’ -> ‘instead of’
Paul — if you read the transcript of what Biden said, he said “The idea he doesn’t realize that Article I of the Constitution defines the role of the vice president of the United States, that’s the Executive Branch. He works in the Executive Branch. He should understand that. Everyone should understand that.”
Article I does NOT define the role of the VP as “being in the Executive Branch,” it defines the role the VP has in the Senate, period. And the way Biden phrased it, it clearly sounds like he’s referring to Article I as deadling with Executive Branch!
Not only that, but Biden can’t seem to decide whether the VP’s role is MERELY that of Pres. of the Senate (as, yes, defined in Article I) or it’s (as he further stated in the debate) “to support the president of the United States of America, give that president his or her best judgment when sought.” If Mr. “The Constitution is Explicit” Biden wanst to get technical, where does THAT role of the VP appear in the Constitution?
I have a RANDOM QUESTION.
CNN.com (? OR CNS.com) writes, “Obama Pays Women Only 78 Percent of What He Pays Men.”
Do you believe that’s true?
Is he REQUIRED to share this information?
Where DOES a Senator get the money to pay his staff?
If he gets the money FROM the US govt, I understand why he would be required to make his records public !!!
“No, miscreant, and you’re full of shit. ”
Aren’t we all, to a certain extent? On some days, you could be the poster boy for being full of shit. While I always appreciate your perspective, I’m at least mature enough to realize we’re not likely to ever be on the same page politically. In a few years, when you’re finally out of the nest and out on your own, I predict your perspective will be a little closer to mine. In the meantime, try to not take it so personal, little man.
“But Palin came to the table with NOTHING outside of constant sloganeering and soundbites. ”
Not unlike Obama, the king of soundbites. But he’s running for PRESIDENT. And Joe Biden came with decades of experience. Big fucking deal. I’ve heard his tiresome shtick several times, in person. He’s a polished, gifted communicator, and very predictable.
“Stop defending this woman.”
In her somewhat unsophisticated way, she spoke very clearly to me. Perhaps because she’s a real person, and not a stereotypical, ivy league educated, asshole lawyer, politician. She’s average, and I can relate to that.
“There WAS no substance there. None.”
According to you. Again, big fucking deal.
Mike reports:
1016 pm: Palin can’t answer the question re: is the VP’s office covered under the Executive Branch.
1017 pm: Biden shatters Palin’s stupidity on the above question. Cheer in the crowd.
—————————————————-
Hube brings the transcript.
““The idea he doesn’t realize that Article I of the Constitution defines the role of the vice president of the United States, that’s the Executive Branch. He works in the Executive Branch. He should understand that. Everyone should understand that.”
——————————-
Hube I basically agree with your response. Where the danger emanates, is when people and Bloggers like to say the other person is wrong. In the Debate, Biden tried to criticize somebody, (?) Cheney. Mike translated what he heard as a loss for Palin.
This Afternoon, Christine O’Donnel on the Rick jensen show tried to criticize Biden for saying that the VP duties are in Article 1.
I read the Constitution then called WDEL. Imagine their surprise to hear that the tenth paragraph of Article 1 contained the sentence explaining “A” duty of the VP is to preside over the Senate. YES, Article 2 describes the Executive powers.
Hube, you say, Biden wanted to get technical. From his words in the TRANSCRIPT, either You or I could TEACH his CLASS at WIDENER, and do a better job.
This is Precisely why BIDEN should retire. He has manipulated the public trust, he has obfuscated the constitution and the laws of this land, and he now presumes a whole new concept to reviewing the Senate confirmation hearings on SCOTUS candidates.
====
Paul
On the USA.
We need more common people running this Government who can speak clearly and plainly to the AMERICAN people. Those who do not need a fancy Philadelphia Lawyer to translate the first ten Amendments to the Constitution of the USA.
We need more Elected officials who are proud of our accomplishments. The SUM Whole of this County since it’s Declaration of Independence in 1776, and it’s Birth in 1777 with the Articles of Confederation and later the Constitution in 1787, has done a COMMENDABLE job. One that FAR exceeds ALL other countries, since those dates.
LET me be clear. THIS country inherited some problems that were imported by it’s colonizing nations. Our founding documents, while balancing certain interests in the necessity for Unity, still laid the Solid Ground work for INDIVIDUAL rights. There IS nothing in the process of guaranteeing those rights over the last 232 years to be ashamed of. YET we have a whole presidential candidacy that disrespects this Nation and Ignores every area that we should show pride.
———-
On the International level, there are issues that I too believe we have failed to live up to our previous examples. BUT lets be very clear, that the direction of this country requires and demands the cooperation of all three branches of Government. When one branch exceeds its powers, or violates it’s trust, the other two branches are supposed to move to make corrections. This Government, and all three branches have corrupted themselves so much that NONE of them have reserved the MORAL CAPITAL necessary to reign in the other aberrant branches when it was necessary.
I purposely use the plural, EACH branch has failed in their own ways.
———–
The American Voter has reduced politics to that of a Sports game. They all choose one side or the other, and some root for some minor teams. BUT there is NO LOGIC in how the teams are chosen, one is Green and the other team is Yellow. Multiple separate single issues divide the fans. America and Americans have forgotten how to play the game, for the sake of the game and the sport. It is not in securing a victory of points. It should be in delivering a Republic and a Democracy organized and working towards the common Good of all its people. To secure this nation first, and then to present a cohesive presence to the rest of the world without ever giving up our own identity.
Paul Falkowski
PAUL !!!!!!!!!!!! PAUL, PAUL, PAUL !!!!!!!!!!!
YOU’RE the one to ask:
Where DOES a Senator get the money to pay his staff?
If he gets the money FROM the US govt, wouldn’t he be required to make that info public ???
I read something I found disturbing this morning, but it’s off topic…
PS.
In my opinion, Palin won hands down. Pretty, manicured hands down.
‘Where DOES a Senator get the money to pay his staff?’
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
United States Senate Appropriations Subcommittee on Legislative Branch
U.S. Senate Appropriations Subcommittee on Legislative Branch is one of twelve subcommittees of the U.S. Senate Committee on Appropriations.
Contents
Jurisdiction
This subcommittee is responsible for funding operations of the U.S. House of Representatives and the United States Senate. The subcomittee recommends funding for several joint agencies of Congress, including the Library of Congress, U.S. Capitol Police, Congressional Budget Office, Government Accountability Office, and the Capitol Visitors Center.
By tradition, the House of Representatives does not oversee or recommend funding levels for the Senate and the Senate does not recommend funding for the House. This includes separate House and Senate activities overseen by the Architect of the Capitol.
The subcommittee sets overall funding levels for Senate salaries, officers, and employees, including the Senate Office of the Vice President,
Office of the Sergeant at Arms, and the Office of the Secretary of the Senate.
Each senator receives an allocation for official expenses, including the hiring of staff and office management.
Funding for both houses of Congress are then combined in the final conference committee report prior to being approved by Congress and sent to the President for his signature.
Paul: Well stated, mi amigo.
If Hillary had said the words that Palin spoke during the debate, and if she would come over that folksy and cutesy, the Republican’s would be ripping her apart. But because it’s Palin, it’s OK.
Palin’s performance was over the top, unconvincing, and fake. It sounded rehearsed at best. But then again, after those incredibly painful interviews before, the GOP probably had her locked into a room and made her memorize lines.
I don’t think Biden did well either, and neither candidate is my top choice for Veep – then again, none of the presidential candidates rock fascinate me either.
This year it will be purely a LESSER EVIL vote, even though I hate doing that.
THANK YOU, PAUL !!!!!!!! ……TANK YOU THANK YOU THAN YOU !!!!!!!!